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Well in the Eastern Conference Kenyon Martin was dominant I think that's what I was referring to, especially since Shaq was on the Lakers then, now that he's on the Nuggets he don't look so dominant since he gotta go up against Garnett and Duncan on a regular basis.

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Well in the Eastern Conference Kenyon Martin was dominant I think that's what I was referring to, especially since Shaq was on the Lakers then, now that he's on the Nuggets he don't look so dominant since he gotta go up against Garnett and Duncan on a regular basis.

So are you calling Keith Van Horn dominant too? They had comparable stat lines and he was just as important on the court as Martin was for the Net's regular season and playoff run in the 2001-2002 season. I don't think anyone wants to call Keith Van Horn dominant. I'm just trying to get people to stop using the word dominant for people who are not. Dominant should be reserved for great players, not good ones. We start throwing it around and it loses its meaning.

Incidentally, a big man playing out east who only pulls down 5.3 rebounds and scores 15 points a game when playing against a mediocre opposition front court isn't impressiving. It may make him better than the other big men in his conference, but it doesn't make him dominant.

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Kenyon martin is better than Keith van Horn, though. I mean, We're saying he's not DOminant like, say Shaq or Garnett, but he still was a big enough presence to help his team win. At least in NJ. The western Conference is like, 1000 Times harder than the eastern conference.

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K-Mart is good, but not an all-star player. There is alot of better PFs out there, like Jermaine O'Neal, Amare Stoudemire, Dirk Nowitzki ect. I know K-Mart isn't on the best team, and going against "easy" competion, but that dosen't mean he can't put up 20 ppg 10 rpg. He is capable.

In other NBA news, Rafer "Skip 2 My Lou" Alston got traded to the Rockets. Skip is a very good, quick point guard who needs some more playing time. I hope he gets some so he can TEAR it up in Houston.

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Kenyon martin is better than Keith van Horn, though. I mean, We're saying he's not DOminant like, say Shaq or Garnett, but he still was a big enough presence to help his team win. At least in NJ. The western Conference is like, 1000 Times harder than the eastern conference.

Kenyon may be a better player now, but in the 2001-2002 season, he and Van Horn were dead even in terms of contribution and importance. The point I was making was that if people are going to say that Martin was the "dominant force" that got the Nets to the finals that year, it would only make sense to call Van Horn dominant in the eastern conference as well. Being able to incorporate Van Horn into this discussion is a good reason to get away from using the word "dominant." No one is saying that Martin wasn't a good big man, but one could add that Van Horn was a big enough presence to help his team get to the finals in 2002 as well. He even pulled down more boards than Martin that year. Lets just refer to Martin as a good big man...

Incidentally, the Nets weren't an inside-outside team those years... They got a lot of their points with J. Kidd, Kittles, Van Horn and Martin running the fast break, penetrating, and shooting. Martin provided them with an inside presence and scoring ability. Van Horn provided them with boards and points.

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PRESEASON OPENER:

Miami Heat 103

San Antonio Spurs 101

Yeah, Walker had a good game with 20 and 5 steals. Wade had 18, Shaq had 17.

Duncan had 16 with Manu and Brent Barry both at 13.

Heat fans are hilarious. They booed the Spurs during introduction, seemingly forgetting that it was a Katrina benefit game. It's going to be a long season.

In other news, Cleveland 116, Washington 94.

I expect Cleavland to make the playoffs this year. As for Washington... time will tell. I'm interested to see how Butler will work out for them. He's a decent player, and he showed that he could do quite a bit last year.

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Well Amare Stoudamire is gonna be out for 4 months now:

Stoudemire will be out 4 months

Paul Coro

The Arizona Republic

Oct. 12, 2005 12:00 AM

Amaré Stoudemire was higher than he gets on one of his dunks nine days ago when he signed a contract extension to cap his "$100-plus million summer."

He awoke on a surgical table Tuesday morning flat on his back with a new reality. Stoudemire will miss Suns games for about four months after an exploratory scope evolved into a microfracture procedure on his left knee.

Suns team physician and orthopedic surgeon Thomas Carter determined Stoudemire would require the microfracture procedure after seeing that his lesion was one centimeter wide, the breaking point of when surgeons choose to perform a microfracture. The procedure involves drilling holes into the bone beneath the damaged cartilage, allowing blood and cells to come through and form a clot that turns into scar cartilage. advertisement

Microfracture is a frightening term for local sports fans to hear after seeing former Suns player Penny Hardaway and ex-Arizona Cardinals defensive linemen Eric Swann and Andre Wadsworth struggle in their returns.

John Stockton was one of the rare NBA players who came away from a microfracture surgery at the same caliber. Hardaway, Terrell Brandon, Chris Webber and Allan Houston were never the same. Stoudemire's case is believed to be less serious than those cases.

Carter assured Suns officials that he believes Stoudemire will return at 100 percent because of his age (22), the smaller size of the lesion and the location of it. The damage was on the inside of his left knee, an area that is not as weight-bearing as others.

"I am confident the microfracture procedure performed will allow a healthy and normal return to action," Carter said in a team statement. He also said the knee was "remarkably and structurally healthy."

The Suns were talking title, and the nation's experts were talking MVP candidacy for Stoudemire until his knee troubles flared up last week. Stoudemire was bothered by knee pain throughout the summer and underwent a magnetic resonance imaging test three weeks ago. He participated in Tucson camp last week but the pain worsened, prompting Friday and Sunday visits to two different specialists.

Stoudemire was aware of the microfracture possibility before the surgery.

"It was better to do the microfracture now instead of chancing that the lesion would grow, which might affect Amaré down the road," said Stoudemire's manager, Rodney Rice, who was in the room during the one-hour operation. "It was best to do the procedure now.

"He's got a lot of things in his favor to come back in a strong way."

Stoudemire will be on crutches for four to six weeks before starting a rehabilitation program. He is expected to return to game action after the All-Star break for a Feb. 15 game. At that time, he would have missed 50 games.

"He'll come back even stronger," Suns coach Mike D'Antoni said. "Amaré will be fine. He'll work hard and he'll be back. The Phoenix Suns will be fine. It's just a matter of waiting it out, being sure we get our team together, and hopefully he pushes us over the top."

Stoudemire cut back off-season workouts due to the pain the lesion caused and missed two camp practices because of it. The lesion is not uncommon among pro athletes, Suns President and General Manager Bryan Colangelo said.

"This is not what you want to do on and off all season, much less on or off for the rest of his six-year contract, so you address the problem now," said Colangelo, who signed Stoudemire to a five-year extension on Oct. 3 that would pay him $72.6 million based on this season's salary cap.

Suns forward Brian Grant heard the news Tuesday morning and looked down at the scar on his left knee from a microfracture surgery. He said his recovery lasted about six or seven months but his lesion was located in a worse place, and the surgeon also was repairing patella damage.

"Wow, he's got a tough road ahead of him," Grant said.

More about microfracture

What it is

Microfracture is a surgical technique used to repair damaged knee cartilage, the material that helps cushion bones at the joints. It is frequently performed on athletes. A version of the procedure can also be used to assist in ligament repair.

How it's done

For cartilage repair, the surgeon, using an arthroscope, drills tiny holes, or microfractures, into the bone near the damaged cartilage. Bone marrow and blood from the holes creates a clot that releases cartilage-building cells. During ligament operations, similar holes are drilled near the surgically repaired areas, and the resulting clot provides an enriched environment to help heal tissue.

Success factors

The resulting microfracture "fibrocartilage" has less capability to withstand common shock or shearing forces in the knee and can degenerate over time. Research suggests that, in the short term, the procedure is more effective in patients with lower body mass indexes.

Sources: The Stone Clinic, Medline Plus Medical Encyclopedia, Orthopedic Technology Review

Big losses

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http://www.nba.com/games/20051012/SASPHI/recap.html

Sixers down the spurs 100 - 88, :gettinjiggywitit:

Just for that, the Sixers are going to get swept by the Spurs during the regular season.

not going to happen, the sixers did that without webber and dalembert, with iverson and korver both played about 25 mins and under

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http://www.nba.com/games/20051012/SASPHI/recap.html

Sixers down the spurs 100 - 88, :gettinjiggywitit:

Just for that, the Sixers are going to get swept by the Spurs during the regular season.

not going to happen, the sixers did that without webber and dalembert, with iverson and korver both played about 25 mins and under

Lol, the talk of sweeping was a joke, but this is the preseason.

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Atlanta Hawks center Jason Collier Passes away at 28..

http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/story/4994316

ATLANTA (AP) - Atlanta Hawks center Jason Collier died Saturday morning, possibly of cardiac arrest, the team said.

According to the Atlanta Journal-Constitution, Collier experienced chest pains and his wife performed CPR and called 911.

Atlanta players were notified of Collier's death at 9:30 a.m. Saturday morning before a scheduled workout was cancelled.

The 7-foot, 260-pound Collier, a five-year NBA player, spent his first three seasons with Houston before joining Atlanta in 2003.

Collier played for Georgia Tech and was drafted by Milwaukee in the first round, with the 15th pick overall, in the 2000 NBA draft.

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