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So do you think LL's trying to knock out Jay-Z?


bigted

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As i said in the other thread. LL also did alot of mistakes with the new album. Terrible first single, terrible video and stupid collabo with J.Lo. He just wasn't hot enough.

About Nas, that's Nas's fault. The album wasn't even ready 'til recently and the first single wasn't chosen until about three weeks ago. The video was shot last week. And Nas even choose a song thats hard to promote as the lead single. Cause yeah... artists on Def Jam nowadays got alot mote own creative freedom and get in the most cases to choose their own first singles and sound on the album.

But, Hiphop-flopping in terms of sales isn't just a Def Jam thing. It's for all of the labels. Ludacris too chose and stupid first single. People ain't even checking for clubsongs so much anymore. What You Know About that ain't a club song. One Blood ain't a club song and Show Me What you got ain't a club song. And those are all albums that prolly going to go plat.

Rappers with washed out clubsongs as first singles are also the rappers who are being downloaded the most. Cause if u don't put out a quality first single... then people ain't gonna buy your CD. And then it doesn't matter how great you album is.

I mean.. LL's album is better than average. Ludacris album too, FP's was great and so on. But they all fell on their terrible lead-singles.

It ain't just about advertizing and promoting. You have to have something you want to tell. You have to have a story and something to offer nowadays. It just doesn't work wth putting out a clubsong and then a album. All of the successes this year have had something other than just good promotion or whatever. Media must want to give them promotion cause interviews and so on isn't anything you can order from a newspaper just like that. You have to have something that attracts attention. And the importance of that kind of promotion cannot be understated because it's the most important promotion. Newspaper-articles, word of mouth and the hype. That's what it's all about. And alot of that weighs on the artists shoulder.

These are all things I've learned studying marketing and economics. It's what i'm going to work with in the future.

Edited by Frenetic
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Well yeah the music industry in general is in a slump right now, not just Def Jam, but really though Def Jam has been about quality music being promoted, that's what seperated them from other labels, but now with promoting Rick Ross and Young Jeezy really they're just another label, Luda's a B-rated rapper so it's a stepup in promotion, but itreally wouldn't be that significant if LL went somewhere else 'cause that label ain't the same anymore, it's really gonna be hard for Jay-Z to live up to the legacy that Russell Simmons left, it's not gonna be easy, but if he wants that title thenhe has to take that responsibility and the criticism that comes with it if he don't deliver, not just use the title for his own benefit if he wants respect for his position,right now Def Jam ain't different from Columbia, Interscope, or the other major labels where before it used to stand out with quality music being promoted and was critically aclaimed....

btw if Interscope drops G-Unit one day I could see Lloyd Banks still having a career if he leaves the group and branches on his own like Game 'cause he got nice mic skills, he's the one that stands out the most in there, and 50's probably gonna try be an actor, he ain't really gonna rap that much longer I believe, he's just milking every minute of fame that he has and when it's gone he won't rap anymore,he's probably asking Will and LL for acting tips right now more than anything, he's working on a film with Samuel L. Jackson, he said in his book that he considers himself a hustler like Diddy so that's what he's gonna try to do, he knows he'll never be the nicest rapper, he's just really doing buisiness moves....

btw, "Control Myself" is cool but J-Lo didn't do anything on it really, it was a nice throwback flow on it with the '80s sample, Janet Jackson would've been perfect on there, she's much more hotter and talented, I don't know why that didn't happen especially with her boo producing the track, I believe if LL did a track with Janet that'd be a huge hit and they could do a real creative video...

Edited by bigted
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btw, "Control Myself" is cool but J-Lo didn't do anything on it really, it was a nice throwback flow on it with the '80s sample, Janet Jackson would've been perfect on there, she's much more hotter and talented, I don't know why that didn't happen especially with her boo producing the track...

Well i dont think JD want Janet anywhere near LL... lol.. He's gonna los love of his life(who's too good for him IMO) to a hunk like LL..

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btw, "Control Myself" is cool but J-Lo didn't do anything on it really, it was a nice throwback flow on it with the '80s sample, Janet Jackson would've been perfect on there, she's much more hotter and talented, I don't know why that didn't happen especially with her boo producing the track...

Well i dont think JD want Janet anywhere near LL... lol.. He's gonna los love of his life(who's too good for him IMO) to a hunk like LL..

Yeah that's true, Marc Anthony got mad at LL 'cause J-Lo was flirting with him during the video shoot, lol

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...It ain't just about advertizing and promoting. You have to have something you want to tell. You have to have a story and something to offer nowadays. It just doesn't work wth putting out a clubsong and then a album. All of the successes this year have had something other than just good promotion or whatever. Media must want to give them promotion cause interviews and so on isn't anything you can order from a newspaper just like that. You have to have something that attracts attention. And the importance of that kind of promotion cannot be understated because it's the most important promotion. Newspaper-articles, word of mouth and the hype. That's what it's all about. And alot of that weighs on the artists shoulder.

These are all things I've learned studying marketing and economics. It's what i'm going to work with in the future.

That's cool that you're getting involved in marketing and promotion on a record label, that's probably something that I'd probably consider doing, I enjoy writing songs and freestyling but I'd probably rather work more behind the scenes than being an artist if I ever make the music buisiness after basically hearing all the struggles artists go through, from reading various artists interviews and books I don't think I'd want that pressure, I like reading Chuck D's terrordomes every month on publicenemy.com 'cause he gives so much insight, I want to start my own imprint in my local area and sign any inspiring artists of any genre as long as they're talented artists that love music and promote and produce for them, I'd probably be more of a producer/song writer than an artist, I don't want all the drama that comes with it, I'm more of a laid back dude, maybe just do an album for fun is what I probably want to ultimately do, btw it's cool how Chuck D emails his fans back, me and him been having a debate on why he considers Jay-Z the best rapper ever, he don't really like much of his songs either but from a skill level he respects him, Chuck D is really more of a friend to his fans than just an artist, I wish more were like him, if I get big one day I want to do the same thing to my fans, he's like the Charles Barkley of rap in my view 'cause of his talents but he also very intelligent and a great commentator, he could talk to you about anything

Edited by bigted
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Speaking of Chuck D I made a post about this on the Enemy board and he responded back:

http://www.publicenemy.com/pb/viewtopic.php?p=172302#172302

"LL is Wilt Chamberlain....Jay is Jordan...embodiment..of everyone up to his point.."-Chuck D:

Then I just replied and made a whole list of what each rapper would be if they're NBA players, that's fun to do, lol:

LL=Jordan

Slick Rick=Ewing

Chuck D= Barkley

Flava Flav=Dennis Rodman(weird as hell but cool at the same time, lol)

EPMD=Pippen and Payton

Redman=Shawn Kemp

Russell Simmons=Phil Jackson

JJFP=Stockton and Malone

Queen Latifah=Cynthia Cooper

Roxanne Chante=Nancy Lieberman

MC Lyte=Lisa Leslie

KRS= Bill Russell(great albums/ championship rings about the same, most consistant careers)

Nas=Shaq

Jay-Z=Kobe

Run-Dmc and Kurtis Blow=Elgin Baylor and Wilt Chamberlain

Dr. Dre=Magic Johnson

50 Cent=Ron Artest(both annoy the hell out of me)

Edited by bigted
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Well Illseed on allhiphop.com now says LL's planning to make some disses towards Jay-Z, hell yeah baby, I can't wait, it's time for everyone to see who the real 23 of rap is, time for LL to get another championship ring to his legacy, I wish Will had some of LL's fire to diss somebody like this 'cause he coulda buried Eminem if he tried harder, all those rich big shots like Eminem do is pay their way on the radio but FP and LL sell records off of skills alone! :bowdown:

http://www.allhiphop.com/rumors/?ID=1154

LL COOL J TO DISS JAY-Z?

Here we are talking two of the greatest battle rappers ever. LL Cool J has taken out all comers, from Canibus to Kool Moe Dee.... Then there is Jay-Z, who dueled with Nas and dropped of more MC's than Aftermath. Rumor has it LL is going to take it to Jay-Z in a rap battle. LL told MTV, "How am I gonna re-sign with competition? I'm not an idiot. I can't depend on that man to promote my record while he's somewhere writing rhymes. I'm LL Cool J. I ain't doing that, B." As you know, 50 Cent and LL have become very good buds. Now, there is a fake Jay-Z diss from 50 Cent that had me confused. But there is a new 50 Cent album in the 07 plan and I heard there are coarse words for Jay-Z coming from LL.

Edited by bigted
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As a Jay & LL fan I'm just sad!

But the thing is that LL got alot more to lose. Jay is at this point much bigger and even ether didn't kill him, he just got bigger. He's too big to be knocked out. Ge might be defeated, but his career won't end.

On the other hand, LL losing the battle would probably end his career. He ain't got the same fanbase or relevance in the Game to survive a public battle without winning it.

Also, IF the battle takes place then LL better plan his release of the song. He should make a real diss song without any subliminals or guest apperances, he def shouldn't diss Jay on someonelses album. It should be like the battle between Jay and Nas. Real songs released on albums, not that halfassed mixtape/internet ****.

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There's no way Jay-Z could defeat LL, LL been in the rap game longer than most of us here been born, he knows what he's doing, he got nothing to lose here, LL's gonna at least hold his own 'cause when he's pissed he gets fired up, he just can't seem to live without the competition, Jay-Z better know what he's doing if he responds, he should be begging LL not to diss him, LL's a big name artist too, even if the battle don't work out, he could have a top playing show on CBS that he's working on and he got a big film deal that he's signed to, his career's set already, it's just something to boost his competitive juices, just sit back and enjoy the battle, 2 big time successful rap artists going at it is gonna be top notch entertainment for the masses, LL's album should at least go platinum like "Lost and Found" alone just the thought of it happening, it's just like when Will said he had something for Eminem

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But yeah.. I really don't care so much about who loses or so. Hiphop could need a old school rapbattle straight up on wax with two really talented dudes.

But yeah, I agree. Jay would be the underdog even though Takeover is in my top 10/5 diss-song list.

LL would top that list though.

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This is pure entertainment, thank god for a real hip-hop battle for a change, this'll be like Jordan in his prime verses Kobe in his prime, both are sure to light up the scoreboard here, top notch competition, I just can't wait really, this is what the game needs, people love the aggressive flows

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I got a question for y'all who made Jay-Z President of Def Jam

I think either Lyor Cohen or Russell Simmons did, they also gave LL his masters though so he makes much more on each album being sold and each time somebody samples him, LL's an artist and he knows that he don't want to jeopardise other artists careers' that's why he didn't take the position, he's a team player, I'm damn sure he was offered the position, maybe if he actually retired from rap for good he'd take it but he still wants to be an artist, he don't want to be like "the big time rap star LL Cool J's rap label", Jay-Z' using the position to hog all the glory the way I see it, especially jumping all these mixtapes and bull**** showing that he wasn't retired, even in his songs he goes "I'm the CEO of Def Jam" and commercials saying "CEO of hip-hop", more of that being promoted than let's say Method Man and The Roots albums for instance, what LL said is the damn truth "Jay-Z is only good at promoting Jay-Z", he won't promote music on a high level 'cause he's scared it'll take away from his legacy

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