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Where are Eminem and Ludacris in your list of greats?


Bob

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One proof is that he often credits more people than himself as co-writers. Also, we know one of his co-writers - Kel Spencer, and has good contact with him and know that he writes for Will...

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Well AJ has an aritcle of Will in the Source back in '98 where he said that he had Nas help him with some lines on "Big Willie Style" 'cause his slang was originally too ol' school on the rhymes he originally wrote for the album, he wanted to bring more current phrases, he knew Nas was a younger dude that had his ear to the streets more than he had lately, he wanted to make his comeback album to hip-hop proper, Nas said that basically in an interview with Carson Daly that he was just vibin' with Will in the studio, he said Big Will had all of his rhymes tight, he was just there to support really, man it'd been even more proper if they did a song together in the process, I wonder if there was some unreleased stuff they did together, they should do a motivational song together to celebrate the release of "Pursuit Of Happiness" and "Hip-Hop Is Dead" all in the same process, that'd be a really great idea but too bad those guys don't think like us, lol.... Now really I look as music as entertainment, sure the whole rap industry wrote on Diddy's album but it has some hot songs on it, "The Chronic" was a tight album even if Dr. Dre didn't write much on it, btw doesn't Jazzy have "help" on some beats he gets credit for? What's the difference between Will getting help and Jazzy getting help? Pharrell helped Teddy Riley produce Rump Shaker right? Didn't Scott Storch help Dre produce some on his latest beats? Music is music to me really, Marvin Gaye didn't write much lyrics but he's the voice of a generation, Mary J. don't write her lyrics either on the mostpart I notice,

now speaking of Ice Cube didn't his cousin Del "help" him write "No Vaseline? "Jesus Walks" was originally Rhymefest's song right? Basically every rapper has had "help" at one point or another, at least 90% of the industry I read in an article, I don't really care though if the music is tight, Jaz-O used to write for Jay-Z back in the days too, really Jay-Z should get back with Jaz-O 'cause I don't feel much of his rhymes these days, lol...

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Well AJ has an aritcle of Will in the Source back in '98 where he said that he had Nas help him with some lines on "Big Willie Style" 'cause his slang was originally too ol' school on the rhymes he originally wrote for the album, he wanted to bring more current phrases, he knew Nas was a younger dude that had his ear to the streets more than he had lately, he wanted to make his comeback album to hip-hop proper, Nas said that basically in an interview with Carson Daly that he was just vibin' with Will in the studio, he said Big Will had all of his rhymes tight, he was just there to support really
Nothin' wrong with any of that.

Now really I look as music as entertainment, sure the whole rap industry wrote on Diddy's album but it has some hot songs on it,

Music is music to me really, Marvin Gaye didn't write much lyrics but he's the voice of a generation, Mary J. don't write her lyrics either on the mostpart I notice,

now speaking of Ice Cube didn't his cousin Del "help" him write "No Vaseline? "Jesus Walks" was originally Rhymefest's song right? Basically every rapper has had "help" at one point or another, at least 90% of the industry I read in an article, I don't really care though if the music is tight, Jaz-O used to write for Jay-Z back in the days too, really Jay-Z should get back with Jaz-O 'cause I don't feel much of his rhymes these days, lol...

But we're not talking about music in general, or R&B, or entertainment, or the industry, we're talking about Hip-Hop.

When you talk about "The Industry" I can get to your point, because I have made my living in "The Industry" for 23 years. From that view point I have no problem whatsoever with getting one of my artists some help or a ghostwriter if they're weak or lack skills. The object in "The Industry" is making hits, and selling little round pieces of plastic and binary files of information. When it comes down to that viewpoint I will do what it takes to achieve this to the best of my ability, including getting my rapper help with his weaknesses. This may even include getting some chicks to shake their booty in the video, and at other points in my life, going along with violent and misogynistic content. Just ask Tim, when it comes to "The Industry" there is no shame in my game, or anyone else's for that matter. This is precisely why I have become a Music Industry Anarchist, because "The Industry" is destroying music in it's pursuit of the almighty dollar.

What we have been talking about is Hip-Hop, which is about a MUCH higher standard than "The Industry".

btw doesn't Jazzy have "help" on some beats he gets credit for? What's the difference between Will getting help and Jazzy getting help? Pharrell helped Teddy Riley produce Rump Shaker right? Didn't Scott Storch help Dre produce some on his latest beats?

No, that is completely different. These guys are musicians, and musicians have always commonly brought in other musicians on their songs and projects. Apples and oranges.

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Just clearing up speculation that FP doesn't write much anymore. Like bigted mentioned, in a 1997 Source article, FP talked about how as he waz writing for Big Willie Style, he worked with Nas. FP would drop some lryics and Nas would step in "how about u say this part like this..." That kinda thing. FP said it waz a way to keep a stable confiedence that he can do his thing and have a new school ear give feedback on it. Then in 2000, Kel mentioned in an XXL interview that he doesn't write songs for FP, but that it's a process of tossing ideas and lyrics back and forth. Kel went after him...not the other way around.

I also have an article from 1992 (a younger-audience based magazine) where JJ+FP talk about writing lyrics. Jazzy says that he handles the music, FP handles the lyrics...but FP adds on that some songs were written while him and friends were just hanging out. I actually liked reading that, becuz when i used 2 write, some of my funniest songs were written that way. Just me and a friend or 2 spitting lyrics back and forth.

Back 2 that 1997 interview, FP said that even while he waz "retired" he waz always writing. Becuz he is a legend, regularly proves what he can do, it doesn't bother me that he collaborates when writing some songs. But for the newer and not-established artists, it's hard 2 believe they can really hold things down on their own.

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ok i saw this vid a couple years back and im pretty sure not many people have seen this video

please take the time to watch this, and the names mentioned are:

Puff Daddy

Foxy Brown

Mase

Will Smith

Jermaine Dupri

Mad Skillz - Ghostwriter (Live)

wow! Skillz really came off disrespectfull towards Will on there....makes me wonder how Will still wants him to write for him....and how come there is so no major beef between them...and how come Jeff and Skillz are so cool.

:paperbag:

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Well Eminem does have skills but at the minute he's just putting those skills to bad use. His word play was awesome back in The Slim Shadey LP days but now he just isnt as good as he used to be. I also wouldn't say that Eminem is the most skillful rapper out cause there are 100's of emcee's who've got more skills than Eminem

and Eminem does talk some bull crap in his lyrics like ''Radio won't evan play my jam''. What the hell? The radio plays his music before anyone else and ''They tried to shut me down on MTV''. Again more bull cause Eminem is always on MTV and TRL

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Well Eminem does have skills but at the minute he's just putting those skills to bad use. His word play was awesome back in The Slim Shadey LP days but now he just isnt as good as he used to be. I also wouldn't say that Eminem is the most skillful rapper out cause there are 100's of emcee's who've got more skills than Eminem

and Eminem does talk some bull crap in his lyrics like ''Radio won't evan play my jam''. What the hell? The radio plays his music before anyone else and ''They tried to shut me down on MTV''. Again more bull cause Eminem is always on MTV and TRL

all i can say is that this is everyone has an opinion but he still is better than 90% rappers out today and ludacris is also highly skilled but forever slept on , and albums aren't sold on word play but good songs

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ok i saw this vid a couple years back and im pretty sure not many people have seen this video

please take the time to watch this, and the names mentioned are:

Puff Daddy

Foxy Brown

Mase

Will Smith

Jermaine Dupri

Mad Skillz - Ghostwriter (Live)

wow! Skillz really came off disrespectfull towards Will on there....makes me wonder how Will still wants him to write for him....and how come there is so no major beef between them...and how come Jeff and Skillz are so cool.

:paperbag:

Skillz didnt say anythin bad abt Will..he just says Will's A&R is on the phone askin Skillz to write to this beat.. no beef

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Well I think some people take songs like that "Ghostwriter" song that Skillz did too seriously, I don't he meant to hurt anyone's feelings, it was just something he was having fun with there

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ok i saw this vid a couple years back and im pretty sure not many people have seen this video

please take the time to watch this, and the names mentioned are:

Puff Daddy

Foxy Brown

Mase

Will Smith

Jermaine Dupri

Mad Skillz - Ghostwriter (Live)

wow! Skillz really came off disrespectfull towards Will on there....makes me wonder how Will still wants him to write for him....and how come there is so no major beef between them...and how come Jeff and Skillz are so cool.

:paperbag:

Skillz didnt say anythin bad abt Will..he just says Will's A&R is on the phone askin Skillz to write to this beat.. no beef

Oh...maybe I misinterpreted what he was saying....I thought he said something like "will be on my ass" (no homo lol). But I guess I misheard due to the fact that it's a live version

and the clarity is hazy...

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Well Eminem does have skills but at the minute he's just putting those skills to bad use. His word play was awesome back in The Slim Shadey LP days but now he just isnt as good as he used to be. I also wouldn't say that Eminem is the most skillful rapper out cause there are 100's of emcee's who've got more skills than Eminem

and Eminem does talk some bull crap in his lyrics like ''Radio won't evan play my jam''. What the hell? The radio plays his music before anyone else and ''They tried to shut me down on MTV''. Again more bull cause Eminem is always on MTV and TRL

all i can say is that this is everyone has an opinion but he still is better than 90% rappers out today and ludacris is also highly skilled but forever slept on , and albums aren't sold on word play but good songs

Albums are sold on MARKETING!

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