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Radewart

"Seven Pounds" is next.

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I loved WWW when most people didn't. I love whatever Will does, regardless the outcome.

But it's not about what I want, it's about the concept. I'm pretty sure Will is doing this more for the oscars than he is doing it to become a better all around actor.

You think Will is doing I Am Legend for an Oscar? You think he's doing John Hancock for an Oscar? Really? Again, people have been complaining and urging him to diversify his roles for the longest time, and now we're questioning his motive (speculating really) for taking on more diverse and serious roles? This might come as a shock, but as serious as his upcoming roles are, he probably won't be getting Oscar nominations for I Am Legend and Hancock... and somehow, I think he knows that... somehow, I don't think he chose those movies looking for an Oscar...

I love Will but the man has all the talent in the world to receive an oscar, and he deserves it too. BUT, when you look at Will's movies, I love all of 'em, but you can't tell me one movie that could go in the top 200 movies ever.Again, i'm not talking about Will's performance, but the movies he's been in. Maybe MIB is considered unique and fits in that category of best ever movies, but it sure isn't a lot.

Note that, compared to the porfolios of others, Will hasn't had that many movies... he also hasn't had that many flops... You should see some of the movies Denzel has done... Not every movie is magic. Most of Will's movies have been science fiction hits... enjoyable blockbuster movies, but not anything that will go down on top 200 lists. He's done only a few serious movies, I can count them on one hand... But, we really can't lament the fact that he doesn't have any movies in top 200 lists if we're going to turn around and accuse him of doing movies that could land on such lists only for Oscars... that, after years of hoping that he would get involved in more serious content.

And when Will is regarded as the most bankable actor in Hollywood, you wonder why he doesn't work with the best of the best that often. He's worked with the best around the 90's and in 2001, but after that he's worked with medicore directors, producers. I'd love for once that he works with the likes of Ridley Scott, Paul Greengrass, Christopher Nolan.My problem isn't with Will's acting, it's with the team he's working with in the past couple years, the quality level hasn't been very high when you compare it to the ID4, Enemy of the State, MIB movies.

Lately, he's done Ali, Bad Boys 2, I, Robot, Shark Tale, Hitch, POH... Those are very diverse movies. All were good... Ali and Bad Boys 2 were big name directors... I, Robot was great regardless of what anyone says... Love that movie... So really, what we're left with is Hitch, POH and Shark Tale... The thing with big name directors is that they are big for a reason, but that doesn't necessarily make them the best for a given project. I Am Legend looks like it is going to be outstanding with Lawrence directing. POH was great for what it was... I'm not sure what more a big name director could have brought to it other than a big name. It was shot beautifully, but the content of the story limited it... and really, what more can you do with the content... people were crying in the movie theater I went to. Muccini really brought the best out of Will... he told him not to simply act the emotion, but to experience it for the camera... and like I said, people were crying in the movie theater... I went to a bookstore and bought the book, the teller asked me if I saw the movie and then told me how much she cried during it. If people want to attribute all of that to Will, that's fine... he's a great actor, but let's not discredit the director...

Again, I'll be there opening day and I'll buy his DVD's regardless of how dissapointing it may be, but I'd love for once that he starts working with those A list directors, producers in the future, he hasn't worked with them much or at all for the past years. Look at Denzel, look at the upcoming movie, American Gangster. I just want him to star in those movies with those directors. That's all.

Denzel's been acting for a very long time and has a huge body of work... I think we have to be patient. Will is only just now making the transition to more serious roles, POH and Ali were great starts, but there will be more to come. Denzel found his niche early and generally stuck with it... Crimson Tide, Philadelphia, Malcolm X.... He doesn't do comedy... I don't think he can do comedy... Will can, and that's why it will take him longer to make his mark doing more serious content.

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You guys are taking it too far... haven't the majority of the few drama movies Will has done been Oscar material... Ali, Pursuit of Happyness... The only one that sucked was Bagger Vance, and for obvious reasons. The negativity has gone overboard. This is the same thing we went through with POH, people whining about the director, people whining about Jaden being cast, people whining about Will only doing dramas for oscars. This movie hasn't even started filming and people are whining... Let's pump our collective brakes and see how things turn out. There is no point in jumping to conclusions off of the minute amount of information we have.

hang on.. Ali was never nominated for best film..pursuit of happyness was never nominated for best film.. only Will's performance.. thats the problem with these movies.. they were "good" not "great" If Will is going to do drama's he needs to select better directors..why not go after the very best?

We can't expect Will to hit gold on two of his first serious lead roles, but I maintain that Ali and POH were great movies for what they were, and with POH, the content is what limited the movie, not the director. I didn't hear many, if any complaints about the directing of POH, and, in fact, heard more praise for how beautifully the movie was shot... how it really explored and depicted what poverty and desperation were like...

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There's not many golden scripts, that are automatically classic movies waiting to be made, but I think a great director and producer can get the best out of a movie. Jerry Bruckheimer & Tony Scott was a great team, that's why we got such a great movie in Enemy of the State plus a great performance by Will..It also had Gene Hackmen in the cast. If you surround yourself with quality people the project will rise above any weaknesses in a script. I've found that since Will is now developing his own movies at Overbrook, the supporting cast has not been great. No big name actors.. the directors have not been the cream of the crop, and the producers fall in that same category. I don't know how the 6 or 7 movies he has in development will turn out in the future, but I think they are missing some great opportunities by not going after the very best.

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You think Will is doing I Am Legend for an Oscar? You think he's doing John Hancock for an Oscar? Really? Again, people have been complaining and urging him to diversify his roles for the longest time, and now we're questioning his motive (speculating really) for taking on more diverse and serious roles? This might come as a shock, but as serious as his upcoming roles are, he probably won't be getting Oscar nominations for I Am Legend and Hancock... and somehow, I think he knows that... somehow, I don't think he chose those movies looking for an Oscar...

When I said ''Will's doing THIS more for the oscar'' I was referring to SP, not IAL or JH. You know, as much as I do, that Hancock and IAL are not oscar material, those type of sci-fi movies almost never make it to the oscars, so it's pointless to relate to this.

Note that, compared to the porfolios of others, Will hasn't had that many movies... he also hasn't had that many flops... You should see some of the movies Denzel has done... Not every movie is magic. Most of Will's movies have been science fiction hits... enjoyable blockbuster movies, but not anything that will go down on top 200 lists. He's done only a few serious movies, I can count them on one hand... But, we really can't lament the fact that he doesn't have any movies in top 200 lists if we're going to turn around and accuse him of doing movies that could land on such lists only for Oscars... that, after years of hoping that he would get involved in more serious content.

Apples and Oranges. The general public, the people who go see Will's movies don't view any of Will's movies as flops. Critics however would disagree with you. You seem to view this situation from one side of the story, the general publics' side. With movies there are 2 sides to please, the general public and the critics. One brings you money, the other respect. We always blame the critics for being cynical (beeep) but they aren't completely wrong you know. I wouldn't compare Denzel to Will but if you must insist, box-office wise Will's the king, but almost all of Denzel's movies have high ratings from critics, something Will almost never has, except for MIB and Enemy of the state. You know with who he worked on Enemy of the state right ? That movie which Tony Scott directed was gold, pure brilliance. Yes I agree with you that working with A-list directors doesn't guarantee success, I don't think I ever stated anything where I said it would, but anyway working with A-list directors can only be a good thing. When you compare Will's B-list directors so to say, to his A-list directors, you'll see the gap I'm trying to refer to. Box-office wise it's not so different, but again Will's charm brings in money regardless how the movie sucks, and WWW is a good example of that.Plus working with A-list directors can also help Will's acting become even THAT MUCH better. There are so many things that A-list directors can bring to a movie compared to B-list directors. There's a reason why the one's called A-list and the other B-list.

Do you think only serious movies (oscar stuff) can make it in the top 200 (or 500, whatever) best movies ever ? That's not really a great way to look at it. Raiders of the lost ark, Star wars, LOTR, Indiana Jones series, Dr. Strangelove, Fight Club, Matrix, Alien, Forrest Gump, Bourne Ultimatum, Terminator....great examples that all genres can make it in the TOP 200. Since Will made movies in almost all genres, it makes you wonder.

Lately, he's done Ali, Bad Boys 2, I, Robot, Shark Tale, Hitch, POH... Those are very diverse movies. All were good... Ali and Bad Boys 2 were big name directors... I, Robot was great regardless of what anyone says... Love that movie... So really, what we're left with is Hitch, POH and Shark Tale... The thing with big name directors is that they are big for a reason, but that doesn't necessarily make them the best for a given project. I Am Legend looks like it is going to be outstanding with Lawrence directing. POH was great for what it was... I'm not sure what more a big name director could have brought to it other than a big name. It was shot beautifully, but the content of the story limited it... and really, what more can you do with the content... people were crying in the movie theater I went to. Muccini really brought the best out of Will... he told him not to simply act the emotion, but to experience it for the camera... and like I said, people were crying in the movie theater... I went to a bookstore and bought the book, the teller asked me if I saw the movie and then told me how much she cried during it. If people want to attribute all of that to Will, that's fine... he's a great actor, but let's not discredit the director...

Those movies have been mediocre. You consider them good, I consider them great, but the critics would disagree. Ali failed, box-office was horrible. BB2 got ripped by critics, I robot, Shark Tale, Hitch and even POH were all considered 60% movies, ratings were mediocre, not so bad, but not so good either. The thing I very much agree with you is that A-list directors doesn't necessarily make them the best for a given project, I can only say amen to that. That's the truth. But, regardless, A-list directors have a bigger, much bigger chance to make any given project so much better. Hitch was great, and many loved it due to Wills' and Kevin James' chemistry. Directing was seriously mediocre, Imagine Judd Apatow directing it. That movie could have went down as one of the greatest romantic comedies ever with that extra touch. That's the problem with Will's latest set of movies, you feel like there's so much more room for development. And that's not Will's fault per se, but the team behind the movie.Muccini, did the best he could given his talent and experience. Nobody discredits him, especially not me.

Denzel's been acting for a very long time and has a huge body of work... I think we have to be patient. Will is only just now making the transition to more serious roles, POH and Ali were great starts, but there will be more to come. Denzel found his niche early and generally stuck with it... Crimson Tide, Philadelphia, Malcolm X.... He doesn't do comedy... I don't think he can do comedy... Will can, and that's why it will take him longer to make his mark doing more serious content.

Will's at least 15 years younger than Denzel, Denzel made approximately 45 movies.

Will already has 26 movies on his name. So I wouldn't quite say the gap is that big between them.

The difference is just in their act of interest. One does mostly sci-fi actions the other likes to do drama/thrillers more than anything.I don't know why the discussion suddenly went into ''Will will be there in time when he takes on more serious roles''....If I'm not mistaken the discussion about SP wasn't about Will's acting.He's a fine actor, I regard him as one of the best. Nobody can take on so many diverse roles and succeed in every one of them.I just wish he utilised those talents more with quality around him. Not always, it doesn't have to be always. He'll always work with Muccini, Tennant... those B-list directors. But I'd like him to work with A-list directors every now and then.That's all.

It's just a wish from me, as a fan, to see Will work with the likes of Judd Apatow, Tony Scott, Paul Greengrass, Christoper Nolan.It's like letting Jordan or Kobe play under doug collins or Del Harris. You wonder how it would have been if they played under...let's say Phil Jackson.

I rest my case.

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Who cares if an A-List director or an B-List director is involved in Will's projects??? If a movie is great it is great...!!! And to qote Will:

Critics don't buy records, people do and I respect that! The same thing goes for movies!

Edited by Jin

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Who cares if an A-List director or an B-List director is involved in Will's projects??? If a movie is great it is great...!!! And to qote Will:

Critics don't buy records, people do and I respect that! The same thing goes for movies!

Well said Jin. If a movie is great it is great! POH couldn't have had a more appropriate director than Gabriele Muccino. Will is just trying to be a better actor. He doesn't need to work with Spielberg to get that goal. Big names doesn't mean Big movies, please.

I, Robot was great regardless of what anyone says... Love that movie..

Well man, thats questionable.

Edited by Ale

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Will's gotten himself to a great position in hollywood.. Why isn't he working with better directors..explain to me that.. I mean Francis Lawrence? come on... Previously the studios had more power and would go after the best.. now Will & Overbrook has the power and they seem to go after the cheapest.. The supporting cast from I, Robot on has been weak.. Nolan, del toro there are some great directors out there..we are not even talking the spielbergs etc and look at some of the actors Will has worked with in the past.. Tommy Lee Jones, Stockard Channing, Ian Mckellen, Gene Hackmen etc

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And to qote Will:

Critics don't buy records, people do and I respect that! The same thing goes for movies!

I'm pretty sure del the funky homosapien said that in catch all this.. when did Will say this?

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Will's gotten himself to a great position in hollywood.. Why isn't he working with better directors..explain to me that.. I mean Francis Lawrence? come on... Previously the studios had more power and would go after the best.. now Will & Overbrook has the power and they seem to go after the cheapest.. The supporting cast from I, Robot on has been weak.. Nolan, del toro there are some great directors out there..we are not even talking the spielbergs etc and look at some of the actors Will has worked with in the past.. Tommy Lee Jones, Stockard Channing, Ian Mckellen, Gene Hackmen etc

But who cares about the director? You gotta judge the movie. You are talking about Francis Lawrence and you haven't seen I am Legend yet. We have to wait. Who cares if he is I am Legend's director? Would it be better if Tony Scott had directed that movie? Probably, but we never know because Will is taking his opportunities, what he thinks it's the right choice. We can't blame him.

I think the only problem here is that most people don't like to see Will in drama; they prefer comedy and science fiction, but we have to respect his decisions.

Edited by Ale

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I've got no problem with Will doing drama. I just miss the days of a great ensemble cast and quality directors involved in his projects.

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I haven't read the whole thread, I'm just gonna drop my opinion. And agree with Max on I, Robot. That was a great movie.

I think personally the whole director thing boils down to who will do the best job on a given movie. I think I said this in the thread sonic made about yes men. Using a big name director isn't always gonna give you the best results, and why some complain about Will not using big name directors, I see no real evidence that anyone else could have done a better job directing. Obviously there is o evidence on the counter either. But a great movie was created with POH, and the only thing I didn't like about that was the chemistry between Will and Thandie, not the directing.

Sure he's the biggest Hollywood star at this moment, but that doesn't mean that the best directors in the world will always do the best job on a WS movie. I think it's great that he's using lesser known directors at this point, because it gives them a chance to get established, and it hasn't damaged Wills cred at all, in fact after using Muccino, its enhanced it. The Spielbergs and Scorcese are not always gonna be here, so its good to get the lesser directors coming through. To me thats like saying, Will is too big to be working with the smaller directors, if you have that mentality, you have an ego, and you think you're too good to work under a director whose not well know. Thats not the mentality to have. You pick who you feel is best for the movie, Scorcese and Spielberg aren't always gonna be the best choice.

Edited by Big Willie

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That's not right, Tim. Warner Bros. picked the director for 'I Am Legend.' Will Smith joined later as producer with his Overbrook Entertainment, when he got the offer to play Neville.

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That's not right, Tim. Warner Bros. picked the director for 'I Am Legend.' Will Smith joined later as producer with his Overbrook Entertainment, when he got the offer to play Neville.

What do you mean, this project has been in the works @ Warner Bros for years.. Will joined the project a few years ago about 2004..he was going to do it with Michael Bay.. then he went for Francis Lawrence..

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People thi doesnt sound like the kind of movie I wanna see Will doing, it all comes back to the Oscar topic we cant just evade... This just doesnt sound like Will Smith and Im not sure if he should go through with it.

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When I said ''Will's doing THIS more for the oscar'' I was referring to SP, not IAL or JH. You know, as much as I do, that Hancock and IAL are not oscar material, those type of sci-fi movies almost never make it to the oscars, so it's pointless to relate to this.

Seven Pounds is the last movie I'd think you would be referring to. We hardly know what it's about. You said:

"I'm pretty sure Will is doing this more for the oscars than he is doing it to become a better all around actor."

How do you know that? Look at the last few movies he's done and will be doing: Pursuit of Happyness, I Am Legend, Hancock and Seven Pounds. All are serious roles, but we know that I Am Legend and Hancock aren't going to get him nominated for Oscars. So what are we saying? For those two movies, he's interested in diversifying his roles, but for POH and Seven Pounds (which we don't know much about), he's doing it more for Oscars? How do we differentiate between the two. The more sensible thing to speculate is that he is simply divesifying his roles, and if Oscar level material arises (which are usually more serious roles), he will take it. But it's obvious that he's not simply picking serious roles if his focus was on Oscar or he wouldn't be doing I Am Legend and Hancock.

Apples and Oranges. The general public, the people who go see Will's movies don't view any of Will's movies as flops. Critics however would disagree with you. You seem to view this situation from one side of the story, the general publics' side. With movies there are 2 sides to please, the general public and the critics. One brings you money, the other respect. We always blame the critics for being cynical (beeep) but they aren't completely wrong you know.

Again, Will hasn't generally done the types of movies that critics will rate highly to any great extent, and admittedly, he doesn't make movies for the critics... he makes them for the fans and the viewers. Moreover, the critics started off as biased since Will doesn't come from an acting background; he comes from hip hop. Early in his career, even with movies like Six Degrees and Bad Boys, he was viewed as a rapper who was trying to act. The label was still there for Independence Day and MIB... It wasn't really until Enemy of the State (a serious role) that he really shed that label. Even to this present day, I've read reviews that have mentioned that Will should stick to acting. There is an inherent bias there, and it hasn't been helped by the fact that the majority of his roles have been action, sci-fi...

The critics have thier place... in this particular discussion, their place and their opinions aren't all that prominent...

I wouldn't compare Denzel to Will but if you must insist, box-office wise Will's the king, but almost all of Denzel's movies have high ratings from critics, something Will almost never has, except for MIB and Enemy of the state. You know with who he worked on Enemy of the state right ? That movie which Tony Scott directed was gold, pure brilliance. Yes I agree with you that working with A-list directors doesn't guarantee success, I don't think I ever stated anything where I said it would, but anyway working with A-list directors can only be a good thing. When you compare Will's B-list directors so to say, to his A-list directors, you'll see the gap I'm trying to refer to. Box-office wise it's not so different, but again Will's charm brings in money regardless how the movie sucks, and WWW is a good example of that.Plus working with A-list directors can also help Will's acting become even THAT MUCH better. There are so many things that A-list directors can bring to a movie compared to B-list directors. There's a reason why the one's called A-list and the other B-list.

Again, it's the types of movies Will has done... fun loving, action adventure, sci-fi roles... not serious roles... The vast majority of Denzel's movies have depicted him in serious roles, but the few that didn't also happened not to do all that well in the box office as well as critically. It's not Will, it's not the directors... it's generally the types of movies. You can get the most critically acclaimed director, but if he's directing Bad Boys 3, know that the movie isn't going to get the best reviews by critics who generally don't view those types of movies positively, regardless of the director attached.

Do you think only serious movies (oscar stuff) can make it in the top 200 (or 500, whatever) best movies ever ? That's not really a great way to look at it. Raiders of the lost ark, Star wars, LOTR, Indiana Jones series, Dr. Strangelove, Fight Club, Matrix, Alien, Forrest Gump, Bourne Ultimatum, Terminator....great examples that all genres can make it in the TOP 200. Since Will made movies in almost all genres, it makes you wonder.

Some of those are classics, but I guarantee you that if you looked up the Sci-fi genre, MIB and Independence Day are in the mix... Cop movies, action/adventure... Bad Boys 1 is somewhere in there... I bet for thrillers, Enemy of the State isn't all that high, but it was an awesome movie, wasn't it? When people talk about how good an actor Will is, I hardly ever hear anyone outside of serious fans mention how good a job he did on Enemy of the State or how good a movie it was. I know people who have never heard of Enemy of the State. Take into account the fact that Will has done a lot of light roles and it's easy to see why he doesn't have a lot of movies in the top 200 or 500. Again, it's the sorts of movies he's done, not the directors he's worked with...

Those movies have been mediocre. You consider them good, I consider them great, but the critics would disagree. Ali failed, box-office was horrible. BB2 got ripped by critics, I robot, Shark Tale, Hitch and even POH were all considered 60% movies, ratings were mediocre, not so bad, but not so good either.

Yeah, I talked about the critics earlier. One thing I must mention is POH.... Universally agreed upon was how great of a job Will and Jaden did and how palpable the bond was... natural... Yet, most of the critics who didn't like the movie took issue with that very thing... How many times did we read about the relationship being too sappy, or being forced... too idealistic... There were critics who complained that the movie placed too much of an emphasis on money and that the movie should have been called "The Pursuit of Richyness," completely missing the message behind the story. Are these the critics that we're extolling so highly? Thank God Will doesn't pick his movies based on how critics would respond.

The thing I very much agree with you is that A-list directors doesn't necessarily make them the best for a given project, I can only say amen to that. That's the truth. But, regardless, A-list directors have a bigger, much bigger chance to make any given project so much better. Hitch was great, and many loved it due to Wills' and Kevin James' chemistry. Directing was seriously mediocre, Imagine Judd Apatow directing it. That movie could have went down as one of the greatest romantic comedies ever with that extra touch.

I think you're overrating what big name directors can do, Ty. What would Judd Apatow have done to make Hitch as great as you imagine he could make it? What would Spielberg have done to make Bad Boys 2 a top 200 movie?

That's the problem with Will's latest set of movies, you feel like there's so much more room for development. And that's not Will's fault per se, but the team behind the movie.Muccini, did the best he could given his talent and experience. Nobody discredits him, especially not me.

I simply don't believe that Will should be chasing after A list directors to do his movies like some desparate sycophant. He should be focused on the movies themselves, not the directors. Yes, it would be nice for him to work with great directors, but I do not believe that this is what will decide his destiny as an actor.

Will's at least 15 years younger than Denzel, Denzel made approximately 45 movies.

Will already has 26 movies on his name. So I wouldn't quite say the gap is that big between them.

26? Really? I don't think it's 26.

The difference is just in their act of interest. One does mostly sci-fi actions the other likes to do drama/thrillers more than anything.I don't know why the discussion suddenly went into ''Will will be there in time when he takes on more serious roles''....If I'm not mistaken the discussion about SP wasn't about Will's acting.He's a fine actor, I regard him as one of the best. Nobody can take on so many diverse roles and succeed in every one of them.

I took the discussion to the ''Will will be there in time when he takes on more serious roles'' because that's exactly what will happen. It will take Will a few serious movies before he can properly find his niche... movies that fit him best and directors that fit him best. Again, remember that though will has been acting for some time, the drama genre is still somewhat new. As he matures in the genre, I expect him to become better at picking movies that fit him and directors that are best for the movie, whether known or unknown... and oftentimes, if not most of the time, the unknown director is best for a movie.

It's just a wish from me, as a fan, to see Will work with the likes of Judd Apatow, Tony Scott, Paul Greengrass, Christoper Nolan.It's like letting Jordan or Kobe play under doug collins or Del Harris. You wonder how it would have been if they played under...let's say Phil Jackson.

I'm glad you mentioned basketball... I think I can rest my case here as well. Not all basketball coaches are the best fit for a given team. Take the Team USA that Larry Brown coached a few years back... they lost three games in the 2004 Olympics. As great a coach as Larry Brown is, and as much talent as he had on that team, that shouldn't have happened, but it did, because he wasn't the best fit for the team. He is a defensive minded coach and likes to slow the game down, taking away a natural advantage that Team USA has over all international competition... speed. He stubbornly sat Carmelo Anthony and Lebron James for long stretches simply because he doesn't like to play young players. Look what he did to Darko in Detroit.

We can't say that Larry Brown would help any given NBA basketball team, inspite of how good of a coach he is. Same thing with a director. He may be a great director, but a lesser known director may be able to do a better job than him.

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